Episode 2: The Most Important Key to Church Health and Flourishing + Baptizing More People + The Most Disgusting Soda in History!

WEBVTT

00:00:29.521 --> 00:00:33.181
<v Chase>Mike Stewart, as they explore the frontiers of ministry and aim for the goal

00:00:33.181 --> 00:00:34.781
<v Chase>of making every church flourish.

00:00:35.001 --> 00:00:39.721
<v Chris>And welcome back into episode two of the Every Church Flourishing podcast.

00:00:39.741 --> 00:00:44.941
<v Chris>You can check out our website, everychurchflourishing.com. I am joined by my

00:00:44.941 --> 00:00:48.901
<v Chris>co-host, Pastor Christopher Cole, who is the Assistant Director of Missions

00:00:48.901 --> 00:00:52.461
<v Chris>for the Great Commission Association here in Central California.

00:00:52.761 --> 00:00:57.701
<v Chris>Today's episode, we have, again, the Senior Directors of the Great Commission

00:00:57.701 --> 00:01:05.321
<v Chris>Association. We're talking about the importance of teamwork and why we do what we do together.

00:01:05.641 --> 00:01:09.881
<v Chris>And before we get to that interview, Pastor Chris, I have a question for you.

00:01:10.441 --> 00:01:15.501
<v Chris>Just generally from your position as the assistant director of missions of one

00:01:15.501 --> 00:01:20.541
<v Chris>of the biggest mission organizations on the West Coast, what is working in California

00:01:20.541 --> 00:01:25.401
<v Chris>in general in terms of church health, church flourishing?

00:01:25.401 --> 00:01:29.401
<v Chris>I'm not necessarily saying what gets buns on seats, what packs the pews,

00:01:29.481 --> 00:01:33.101
<v Chris>but you could certainly answer that. But generally speaking, what

00:01:33.392 --> 00:01:38.792
<v Chris>is strategically working out here on the West Coast, the left coast,

00:01:38.932 --> 00:01:42.752
<v Chris>that brings flourishing aspects to a church?

00:01:42.912 --> 00:01:49.972
<v Mike>There's no great way to answer that question that doesn't begin with what Jesus says in John chapter 15.

00:01:50.172 --> 00:01:50.692
<v Chris>Amen.

00:01:50.932 --> 00:01:56.592
<v Mike>Any real, lasting, abiding fruit has to start with connection with God.

00:01:56.592 --> 00:02:02.852
<v Mike>It has to start with the people of God being restored if they're not in right relationship with God,

00:02:03.152 --> 00:02:07.812
<v Mike>repenting, drawing close to God, humbling themselves, and not just doing that

00:02:07.812 --> 00:02:11.672
<v Mike>in a one-off worship service, although those certainly can be catalytic,

00:02:11.972 --> 00:02:16.972
<v Mike>but doing that in a persisting way where the people are committed to abiding

00:02:16.972 --> 00:02:20.392
<v Mike>with Christ in an intimate way.

00:02:20.592 --> 00:02:26.612
<v Mike>And then I think that flows out of that comes a passion for the things that God really cares about.

00:02:26.792 --> 00:02:30.932
<v Mike>And that means that we get a heart for being fruitful.

00:02:31.192 --> 00:02:36.772
<v Mike>And I don't know of any church that is being fruitful that doesn't have a heart for being fruitful.

00:02:36.952 --> 00:02:41.232
<v Mike>That's true across the United States, and I think it's true here in California,

00:02:41.232 --> 00:02:47.892
<v Mike>in our San Francisco Bay Area region that extends all the way down California's central coast.

00:02:47.992 --> 00:02:53.172
<v Mike>If a church doesn't want to be fruitful, if they don't see that as part of their

00:02:53.172 --> 00:02:57.892
<v Mike>God-given commission and passion, and they're not brokenhearted,

00:02:57.892 --> 00:02:59.592
<v Mike>for example, for the lost,

00:02:59.912 --> 00:03:04.512
<v Mike>With a deep desire to reach their communities with the good news of Jesus Christ,

00:03:04.832 --> 00:03:07.892
<v Mike>then they're not going to be fruitful.

00:03:08.132 --> 00:03:14.492
<v Mike>So every church that I know of that is growing, is healthy, is dynamically engaging

00:03:14.492 --> 00:03:17.832
<v Mike>their communities, they've got both of those elements going on.

00:03:17.932 --> 00:03:21.652
<v Mike>They really are abiding with and loving God well,

00:03:22.031 --> 00:03:26.871
<v Mike>And they have developed a passion and a love for their community.

00:03:27.111 --> 00:03:33.051
<v Mike>You know, we don't have the option of looking for Christian microculture out here.

00:03:33.471 --> 00:03:37.331
<v Mike>And in many ways, Chase, I don't know how you feel. You pastored in Alabama

00:03:37.331 --> 00:03:39.991
<v Mike>a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away.

00:03:40.111 --> 00:03:45.231
<v Mike>I was a pastor in Texas. And one of the refreshing things for me is that we

00:03:45.231 --> 00:03:50.431
<v Mike>don't deal with Christian ease or Christianized subcultures.

00:03:51.111 --> 00:03:55.651
<v Mike>Out here, you have a choice to be authentic. And I think that's a third key.

00:03:55.851 --> 00:04:00.791
<v Mike>If you're going to really be abiding with Christ and have a real heart for the

00:04:00.791 --> 00:04:05.711
<v Mike>lost and what's going to work, what's going to follow out of that in engaging

00:04:05.711 --> 00:04:10.771
<v Mike>this is that you've got to be committed to being authentic and real. Yeah.

00:04:11.051 --> 00:04:17.571
<v Mike>Californians are allergic to hypocrisy. They're allergic to let's tolerate sort

00:04:17.571 --> 00:04:24.911
<v Mike>of the idea of religion or the aspirations of a religious system if you're not going to live it out.

00:04:25.111 --> 00:04:29.131
<v Mike>They're tolerant. I think sociologically, they're very, very tolerant.

00:04:29.371 --> 00:04:31.731
<v Mike>They're tolerant of a lot of brokenness.

00:04:32.078 --> 00:04:37.338
<v Mike>But they don't want you to be inauthentic. So sort of starting maybe,

00:04:37.458 --> 00:04:38.978
<v Mike>I guess, on that more meta level,

00:04:38.978 --> 00:04:45.418
<v Mike>I think that can drive some habits and practices of healthy churches.

00:04:45.638 --> 00:04:49.018
<v Mike>Every healthy church that I know of in our region that's flourishing,

00:04:49.238 --> 00:04:54.318
<v Mike>they do really well at engaging guests that come to visit them.

00:04:54.438 --> 00:04:59.418
<v Mike>They have a plan and an intention to engage those who come to visit.

00:04:59.418 --> 00:05:05.898
<v Mike>All of those churches have different types of plans of reaching out to their community.

00:05:05.898 --> 00:05:12.418
<v Mike>That may be that they do block parties or they may have micro groups that are

00:05:12.418 --> 00:05:16.138
<v Mike>scattered throughout their community that invite people to home barbecues,

00:05:16.218 --> 00:05:20.678
<v Mike>but they have an intentional plan to engage their community.

00:05:20.678 --> 00:05:22.018
<v Mike>They have an intentional plan

00:05:22.018 --> 00:05:27.138
<v Mike>and strategy to greet people that come and they have a plan to reach out.

00:05:27.658 --> 00:05:30.938
<v Mike>Those two components are just really key.

00:05:31.338 --> 00:05:34.758
<v Mike>And then they're persistent at it. They're persistent at being authentic with

00:05:34.758 --> 00:05:39.198
<v Mike>their faith. Of course, you've got to preach the word of God. You've got to pray.

00:05:39.438 --> 00:05:42.698
<v Mike>You've got to do those basics really well.

00:05:42.978 --> 00:05:47.618
<v Mike>I don't think you can do them poorly and be fruitful in the long run.

00:05:48.258 --> 00:05:54.238
<v Mike>Churches that have no prayer ministry are going to experience very little vitality.

00:05:54.338 --> 00:05:55.858
<v Chris>Apart from him, we can do nothing.

00:05:56.465 --> 00:06:02.405
<v Mike>That's right. And churches that have very little commitment to exegetical preaching

00:06:02.405 --> 00:06:07.225
<v Mike>of God's word tend not to flourish, at least in our evangelical world.

00:06:07.325 --> 00:06:12.645
<v Mike>I recognize there's some churches out there that might have very different value

00:06:12.645 --> 00:06:17.325
<v Mike>systems that might be able to gather a crowd, but I'm talking about churches

00:06:17.325 --> 00:06:20.625
<v Mike>that make disciples, which leads me to my last thing.

00:06:20.745 --> 00:06:26.905
<v Mike>They not only have a plan for inviting people in and greeting people well and

00:06:26.905 --> 00:06:31.805
<v Mike>then reaching out, but they have a plan and a strategy for making disciples.

00:06:32.105 --> 00:06:34.005
<v Mike>They have a discipleship pathway.

00:06:34.689 --> 00:06:39.009
<v Mike>Now, that could be very different. And some churches, that's all built around

00:06:39.009 --> 00:06:43.389
<v Mike>micro groups or micro network discipleship strategies.

00:06:43.709 --> 00:06:46.389
<v Mike>Other groups, it's a house church strategy.

00:06:46.829 --> 00:06:51.029
<v Mike>Other groups, it's lots of one-on-one discipling that's going on,

00:06:51.509 --> 00:06:52.709
<v Mike>different ways of doing it.

00:06:52.869 --> 00:06:59.269
<v Mike>But they have a plan to make disciples and develop disciples who not only grow

00:06:59.269 --> 00:07:01.429
<v Mike>themselves, but in turn make disciples.

00:07:02.189 --> 00:07:05.749
<v Mike>And honestly, I'm not sure that's any different than anywhere else in the world.

00:07:06.589 --> 00:07:12.049
<v Mike>You've got to do those things well. Maybe if I were to give one other California-type

00:07:12.049 --> 00:07:13.909
<v Mike>hint, and I would say that's this.

00:07:14.089 --> 00:07:21.349
<v Mike>The Greek Orthodox theologian—now, here I'm throwing a Greek Orthodox theologian into a Baptist podcast,

00:07:21.469 --> 00:07:23.109
<v Chris>Right? My friend Sam will be very excited.

00:07:23.269 --> 00:07:27.389
<v Mike>The Greek Orthodox theologian Alexander Schmiemann—I hope I'm saying his name

00:07:27.389 --> 00:07:30.589
<v Mike>right—wrote a book called For the Life of the World.

00:07:31.229 --> 00:07:37.209
<v Mike>And it's actually from Jesus speaking about being the bread of life.

00:07:37.349 --> 00:07:40.109
<v Mike>I think it's John chapter six, right?

00:07:40.269 --> 00:07:45.029
<v Mike>He says, I give this my body for the life of the world. One way that gets translated.

00:07:45.409 --> 00:07:53.429
<v Mike>And you can't be opposed to the culture and the community in which you live

00:07:53.429 --> 00:08:00.429
<v Mike>in a way that shows them that really you hate them or you look down on them or you despise them.

00:08:00.589 --> 00:08:06.409
<v Mike>If you want to reach them and the churches that are growing and thriving,

00:08:07.209 --> 00:08:10.509
<v Mike>see themselves as being for their community.

00:08:10.729 --> 00:08:15.629
<v Mike>So like you pastor in Salinas, you've got to be for Salinas. Yeah.

00:08:15.784 --> 00:08:19.984
<v Mike>Not against Salinas. Now, we're not talking about compromising with the world

00:08:19.984 --> 00:08:27.264
<v Mike>or worldly values or giving into immorality or all of those kinds of things.

00:08:27.384 --> 00:08:32.224
<v Mike>What we are saying is that you've got to be more for a community than you are

00:08:32.224 --> 00:08:34.444
<v Mike>against it. Tim Keller used to-

00:08:34.444 --> 00:08:35.864
<v Chris>Keller hit on that all the time.

00:08:36.124 --> 00:08:40.784
<v Mike>All the time, right? All the time saying, listen, you were to seek the good

00:08:40.784 --> 00:08:42.984
<v Mike>of the communities that we are in.

00:08:43.364 --> 00:08:51.764
<v Mike>And people out here have an allergy, I would say, to churches that are oppositionally

00:08:51.764 --> 00:08:55.164
<v Mike>aligned to everything the community stands for.

00:08:55.424 --> 00:09:00.564
<v Mike>And to be frank, I've met quite a few pastors, many of them that come from out

00:09:00.564 --> 00:09:05.524
<v Mike>of state, that approach ministry in California by trying to gather the people

00:09:05.524 --> 00:09:09.464
<v Mike>that are disaffected with being Californian.

00:09:09.624 --> 00:09:12.684
<v Mike>Sort of, you know, let's just gather are all the people that are disaffected

00:09:12.684 --> 00:09:17.124
<v Mike>and angry we're angry at the california government we're angry at our communities

00:09:17.124 --> 00:09:21.584
<v Mike>we're angry at the world's values and so we end up with these little angry churches

00:09:21.584 --> 00:09:23.604
<v Mike>right yeah militant but if

00:09:23.923 --> 00:09:29.423
<v Mike>militant, but not really gospel-centered. But if you've got the gospel of Jesus

00:09:29.423 --> 00:09:33.263
<v Mike>Christ and you understand what Jesus has done for you, there is no way that

00:09:33.263 --> 00:09:37.923
<v Mike>we can approach any person with the spirit of condemnation, a spirit of hatred,

00:09:38.163 --> 00:09:41.483
<v Mike>a spirit of opposition to who they are.

00:09:41.683 --> 00:09:47.043
<v Mike>We can, in fact, actually be for the life of the world.

00:09:47.163 --> 00:09:49.723
<v Mike>And I think that's what Christ is calling us to do.

00:09:49.723 --> 00:09:52.943
<v Chris>Yeah, you talked about inauthentic earlier.

00:09:53.223 --> 00:09:55.983
<v Chris>I think that's something every church needs to wrestle with.

00:09:56.083 --> 00:10:00.503
<v Chris>And you also pointed out the importance of welcoming people who are visitors.

00:10:00.983 --> 00:10:04.843
<v Chris>And when I do go out of town, when I'm not at my home church,

00:10:05.023 --> 00:10:07.543
<v Chris>I tend to go to church with my parents.

00:10:07.723 --> 00:10:11.563
<v Chris>Maybe we're visiting with them or Janet's parents, and they both go to really

00:10:11.563 --> 00:10:15.863
<v Chris>big churches. And I've been to several mega churches over the years,

00:10:15.863 --> 00:10:19.863
<v Chris>and I noticed they're excellent at greeting people.

00:10:20.043 --> 00:10:27.023
<v Chris>They're extremely intentional about it. They put a lot of people into the welcoming ministry.

00:10:27.023 --> 00:10:32.843
<v Chris>But I will say that there is a, not naming any kind of specific churches or

00:10:32.843 --> 00:10:38.263
<v Chris>whatever, but I have been to churches where it's almost a Stepford Wives,

00:10:38.423 --> 00:10:41.243
<v Chris>kind of too happy, too bright and shiny.

00:10:41.583 --> 00:10:47.583
<v Chris>People greet you like they were your long lost brother you haven't seen in 10 years.

00:10:47.743 --> 00:10:54.063
<v Chris>And it's a kind of happiness that for me, a lot of people like it.

00:10:54.183 --> 00:10:59.803
<v Chris>It obviously works and it grows some churches. But for me, I would much prefer...

00:11:00.607 --> 00:11:09.287
<v Chris>Rather than bright, hot, gleaming, polished smiles, I would much prefer something

00:11:09.287 --> 00:11:15.447
<v Chris>a little bit more genuine and warm and real, and to use your word, authentic.

00:11:15.827 --> 00:11:19.207
<v Chris>And I think the way to make that happen, a couple of years ago,

00:11:19.307 --> 00:11:23.327
<v Chris>we took our church through some of Tom Rainer's stuff on welcoming visitors,

00:11:23.487 --> 00:11:24.767
<v Chris>which I think is very, very solid.

00:11:24.767 --> 00:11:30.107
<v Chris>And I think having a strategy and awareness of how important it is to be a welcoming

00:11:30.107 --> 00:11:32.467
<v Chris>church to visitors is important.

00:11:32.467 --> 00:11:39.447
<v Chris>But the way that that becomes authentic and a part of your culture is not to have a program.

00:11:39.447 --> 00:11:44.807
<v Chris>It's to preach the gospel and the epistles and the teachings of Jesus and to

00:11:44.807 --> 00:11:51.327
<v Chris>have a people who value biblical humility, biblical serving, biblical love,

00:11:51.847 --> 00:11:55.567
<v Chris>biblical kindness, biblical listening, all of that kind of stuff.

00:11:55.767 --> 00:12:02.227
<v Chris>And there's no program or strategy or whatever that replaces the kind of outflow

00:12:02.227 --> 00:12:08.407
<v Chris>of the fruit of the Spirit that should come from an authentic church with real greeters.

00:12:08.487 --> 00:12:13.007
<v Chris>I think that's massively important to reach your community.

00:12:13.007 --> 00:12:18.107
<v Chris>It may not grow you into a megachurch, but it will grow you into a place where

00:12:18.107 --> 00:12:23.647
<v Chris>people will come feel welcomed and feel real warm.

00:12:23.807 --> 00:12:28.867
<v Mike>And you know, I think that authenticity extends into the other aspects that I was talking about.

00:12:29.333 --> 00:12:34.313
<v Mike>People don't want to be sold on Jesus. It's not the same as saying we don't

00:12:34.313 --> 00:12:38.513
<v Mike>want to invite them to a real-world encounter with the good news of Jesus Christ

00:12:38.513 --> 00:12:40.053
<v Mike>and the hope that we have for them.

00:12:40.173 --> 00:12:45.713
<v Mike>And that does include being authentic about the fact that we are sinners in need of God's grace,

00:12:45.913 --> 00:12:52.153
<v Mike>that we have the hope of Christ's atonement on our behalf, that we have the

00:12:52.153 --> 00:12:57.513
<v Mike>passionate belief in the resurrection and the transforming grace of Jesus, right?

00:12:57.513 --> 00:13:04.793
<v Mike>And so when we center that gospel into the middle of these kinds of authentic relationships,

00:13:05.133 --> 00:13:11.153
<v Mike>that should overflow into not only how we greet guests, but how we do outreach

00:13:11.153 --> 00:13:16.753
<v Mike>and how we invite people into the process of becoming a follower of Jesus,

00:13:16.913 --> 00:13:22.573
<v Mike>and then how we teach them how to grow up to be followers of Jesus and that

00:13:22.573 --> 00:13:23.953
<v Mike>discipleship mechanism.

00:13:24.033 --> 00:13:28.673
<v Mike>And if you have authenticity in all of that, and people know that you are genuinely

00:13:28.673 --> 00:13:35.113
<v Mike>seeking the good that God wants to bring to their city, their community,

00:13:35.373 --> 00:13:38.753
<v Mike>their ethnicity, their socioeconomic group,

00:13:39.213 --> 00:13:41.873
<v Mike>then there's a tremendous power for transformation.

00:13:42.173 --> 00:13:48.273
<v Mike>And I think that's what draws people in to say, hey, I want to know more about

00:13:48.273 --> 00:13:51.253
<v Mike>this God that is amongst you and the hope that you have.

00:13:51.613 --> 00:13:58.533
<v Chris>Yes. Amen. Amen to that. Speaking of overflowing, Chris, I made a strategic mistake last night.

00:13:59.073 --> 00:14:06.013
<v Chris>I put four of our sodas in the refrigerator and I left out the most important one.

00:14:06.173 --> 00:14:13.673
<v Chris>And today we are reviewing Lester's Fixin's Ranch Dressing Soda.

00:14:14.210 --> 00:14:18.190
<v Chris>Which I never heard of prior to Grace finding it.

00:14:18.370 --> 00:14:26.430
<v Chris>And I think of all of the sodas not to chill ahead of time, one based on ranch

00:14:26.430 --> 00:14:30.870
<v Chris>soda might be the single worst.

00:14:31.170 --> 00:14:33.570
<v Mike>Room temp ranch dressing soda.

00:14:33.790 --> 00:14:39.490
<v Chris>It doesn't sound like a great start. And I will say, Lester's Fixins has some

00:14:39.490 --> 00:14:44.890
<v Chris>great sodas on Amazon. there's one grass soda, which has four stars.

00:14:45.370 --> 00:14:51.410
<v Chris>Sadly, ranch dressing soda on Amazon has 2.9 stars.

00:14:51.730 --> 00:14:54.070
<v Mike>Oh, you're influencing our Spurgeon scale.

00:14:54.250 --> 00:14:58.390
<v Chris>I know. I know. But they didn't measure it on Spurgeon. So maybe we'll come

00:14:58.390 --> 00:14:59.890
<v Chris>up with something completely different.

00:15:00.070 --> 00:15:05.010
<v Mike>Well, my wife loves ranch dressing. Now, she does not drink soda at all.

00:15:05.150 --> 00:15:05.670
<v Chris>Okay.

00:15:05.890 --> 00:15:11.950
<v Mike>So I will have to review this for her. and who knows, it might temp her. Let's go.

00:15:12.090 --> 00:15:17.450
<v Chris>Take a smell before you take a drink. Oh, exactly. Oh, that hurts.

00:15:17.830 --> 00:15:21.110
<v Mike>Oh, I'm not smelling the pure cane sugar.

00:15:21.190 --> 00:15:25.490
<v Chris>No, I'm smelling the, a little bit rancid ranch. I don't know.

00:15:25.630 --> 00:15:30.410
<v Chris>I don't know what Lester was thinking about when he invented this soda, but you know what?

00:15:30.510 --> 00:15:35.850
<v Chris>He obviously sold it to us, so I bet other people bought it too. Let's give it a shot.

00:15:35.850 --> 00:15:36.330
<v Mike>Let's do it.

00:15:39.131 --> 00:15:41.751
<v Chris>Wow. Okay.

00:15:42.351 --> 00:15:44.071
<v Mike>Okay. Wow.

00:15:44.471 --> 00:15:48.451
<v Chris>That was a little bit of unscripted, stunned silence right there.

00:15:50.431 --> 00:15:55.031
<v Mike>That is something I have never, you know, as an ex-missionary,

00:15:55.271 --> 00:15:57.811
<v Mike>I have put a lot of weird things into my mouth.

00:15:57.811 --> 00:16:07.511
<v Mike>This right here, Lester's Ranch Dressing Soda, might be moving close to my top

00:16:07.511 --> 00:16:10.991
<v Mike>10 of weird, weird things to put in your mouth.

00:16:11.491 --> 00:16:14.871
<v Chris>This is crazy. Oh, you're taking another drink. That's bold.

00:16:19.048 --> 00:16:25.048
<v Mike>I don't know how to describe this. How do you describe sweet ranch dressing?

00:16:26.928 --> 00:16:33.808
<v Chris>It honestly tastes like somebody had a little bit of a pina colada drink and

00:16:33.808 --> 00:16:34.828
<v Chris>mixed a tablespoon with ranch.

00:16:34.828 --> 00:16:38.608
<v Mike>But you would not know what that's like as a Baptist pastor.

00:16:38.728 --> 00:16:42.348
<v Chris>Oh, no. A virgin pina colada, I should say. Oh, there you go. No alcohol.

00:16:42.508 --> 00:16:47.068
<v Mike>There you go. That's right. and they mix you think that it's like a pina colada

00:16:47.068 --> 00:16:51.948
<v Mike>and they mixed a tablespoon i i would say they mix more than a tablespoon oh

00:16:51.948 --> 00:16:53.608
<v Mike>into their pina colada yeah

00:16:53.608 --> 00:16:56.888
<v Chris>That that aftertaste is going to stay with me for a while.

00:16:56.888 --> 00:17:04.508
<v Mike>This is uh it it says y'all get your fixings right yeah which is of course lester's

00:17:04.508 --> 00:17:11.988
<v Mike>motto yep i i would not encourage you to get this lester's fixin all right i'm

00:17:11.988 --> 00:17:14.228
<v Mike>going to be bold before we do the Spurgeons.

00:17:14.408 --> 00:17:19.548
<v Mike>I'm going to give it one more shot. One more here and, and see how we're doing.

00:17:19.728 --> 00:17:22.728
<v Chris>Well, I'll not be a coward. Hmm.

00:17:23.468 --> 00:17:27.768
<v Chris>It starts off and you think this is going to be good. And then the,

00:17:27.768 --> 00:17:32.868
<v Chris>the rest of it hits you and you're like, Oh, this is rancid.

00:17:33.068 --> 00:17:37.948
<v Mike>Uh, I, you say pina coli. I was thinking the front end And sort of tastes like

00:17:37.948 --> 00:17:39.208
<v Mike>you're getting a cream soda.

00:17:39.648 --> 00:17:41.028
<v Chris>Yeah. Okay. Cream soda.

00:17:41.548 --> 00:17:49.348
<v Mike>And then like somebody poured in a bunch of the ranch dressing powder into a

00:17:49.348 --> 00:17:51.208
<v Mike>cream soda and then shook that up.

00:17:51.868 --> 00:17:58.868
<v Mike>It's not good, folks. I'm going to give this a zero out of five Spurgeons. This is not good.

00:17:59.419 --> 00:18:02.199
<v Mike>Probably the worst soda that we will taste on this show.

00:18:02.459 --> 00:18:03.099
<v Chris>I hope.

00:18:03.299 --> 00:18:10.399
<v Mike>Maybe I'll give it a half Spurgeon, but that is not good. I would not consume that.

00:18:10.559 --> 00:18:13.699
<v Mike>I would not recommend it except as a joke. How about you, Pastor Chase?

00:18:13.819 --> 00:18:15.359
<v Mike>How many Spurgeons would you give this thing?

00:18:15.379 --> 00:18:23.159
<v Chris>Chris, not only would I not give this a single Spurgeon, I wouldn't give this but half a Joel Osteen.

00:18:23.419 --> 00:18:27.219
<v Chris>This stuff is nasty. It's so bad.

00:18:27.359 --> 00:18:32.939
<v Chris>It's terrible. But it does raise some interesting questions about ranch dressing in general.

00:18:33.139 --> 00:18:38.119
<v Chris>So now it's time for you to play the ranch dressing trivia challenge.

00:18:38.419 --> 00:18:43.419
<v Chris>And here's the first question. In the 1950s, a plumber named, yes, a plumber,

00:18:43.759 --> 00:18:49.019
<v Chris>Steve Henson bought a dude ranch in California and he served his homemade dressing

00:18:49.019 --> 00:18:53.979
<v Chris>to his guests, which would eventually become what we know of as ranch dressing.

00:18:53.979 --> 00:18:58.279
<v Chris>Since the ranch was located in a valley tucked away in the mountains,

00:18:58.279 --> 00:19:00.339
<v Chris>what did he name that ranch?

00:19:01.019 --> 00:19:05.159
<v Mike>Well, I actually know this one. It's Hidden Valley Ranch.

00:19:05.159 --> 00:19:07.659
<v Chris>You got it. That's right. And how do you know it?

00:19:07.859 --> 00:19:11.339
<v Mike>We live in California's agricultural area.

00:19:11.499 --> 00:19:11.759
<v Chris>We do.

00:19:11.959 --> 00:19:18.379
<v Mike>And in fact, there is a little hidden valley. By the way, you may not know this, Pastor Chase.

00:19:18.679 --> 00:19:22.139
<v Mike>There's a little hidden valley. It's not the Hidden Valley Ranch place,

00:19:22.319 --> 00:19:27.819
<v Mike>but there's a little valley called Hidden Valley down around the Paso Robles

00:19:27.819 --> 00:19:33.539
<v Mike>area, and they use that Hidden Valley sort of ethos and everything else.

00:19:33.679 --> 00:19:36.619
<v Mike>But that's, yeah, it's Hidden Valley Ranch. I got that.

00:19:36.739 --> 00:19:41.019
<v Chris>I'll do you one better than that. The original Hidden Valley Ranch is within

00:19:41.019 --> 00:19:45.199
<v Chris>the footprint of the GCA right around Santa Barbara, California.

00:19:46.195 --> 00:19:52.615
<v Chris>So it is in our territory, so to speak. The Hidden Valley Ranch is in California. How about that?

00:19:53.035 --> 00:19:55.855
<v Mike>That's amazing. So, so cool.

00:19:56.295 --> 00:19:59.835
<v Chris>Yep. All right. Question number two. You are one for one so far.

00:19:59.995 --> 00:20:05.795
<v Chris>So ranch dressing is a very American obsession because the flavor is so uniquely

00:20:05.795 --> 00:20:07.495
<v Chris>tied to the United States of America.

00:20:07.595 --> 00:20:12.055
<v Chris>If you were to say be in the Netherlands or Iceland or Ireland or whatever,

00:20:12.195 --> 00:20:14.915
<v Chris>and you bought a bag of Cool Ranch Doritos.

00:20:15.015 --> 00:20:17.515
<v Chris>It's not called Cool Ranch.

00:20:17.695 --> 00:20:20.855
<v Chris>Instead, it's called cool what?

00:20:21.455 --> 00:20:23.935
<v Mike>Cool Vegetable Flames.

00:20:24.015 --> 00:20:26.455
<v Chris>I'll give you a hint. It's a nationality.

00:20:26.855 --> 00:20:28.335
<v Mike>The Cool American?

00:20:28.675 --> 00:20:35.055
<v Chris>You got it. That is what it's called in other countries. Cool American chips.

00:20:35.755 --> 00:20:40.335
<v Chris>All right, one more. Ranch is basically a mixture of mayonnaise and herbs and

00:20:40.335 --> 00:20:42.855
<v Chris>onion, garlic powder, dill and parsley.

00:20:43.075 --> 00:20:48.555
<v Chris>But to get that tang, you need to mix in a specific dairy product,

00:20:48.835 --> 00:20:55.235
<v Chris>the same sour liquid that's used to make pancakes fluffy and biscuits rise. What is that?

00:20:56.098 --> 00:20:57.958
<v Mike>You got to mix in buttermilk.

00:20:58.278 --> 00:20:59.558
<v Chris>Buttermilk, that's right.

00:20:59.798 --> 00:21:00.958
<v Mike>It's fast as buttermilk.

00:21:01.098 --> 00:21:08.998
<v Chris>And you can taste the buttermilk in this awful satanic soda that we've been drinking.

00:21:09.318 --> 00:21:12.018
<v Chris>You can taste it, and it scares me.

00:21:12.238 --> 00:21:19.538
<v Mike>All right, folks, we can say wholeheartedly, buy this for your worst enemy as

00:21:19.538 --> 00:21:25.058
<v Mike>you are seeking to bless them or your best friend because you want to have a

00:21:25.058 --> 00:21:27.778
<v Mike>good laugh with them drinking this,

00:21:27.938 --> 00:21:31.338
<v Mike>maybe cover up the label so they don't know what it is.

00:21:31.558 --> 00:21:35.378
<v Mike>Because this stuff's not great. It's grim.

00:21:35.698 --> 00:21:42.198
<v Chris>It's pretty grim. So, Pastor Chris, I think to wash that terrible taste out

00:21:42.198 --> 00:21:47.798
<v Chris>of our mouth, we're going to play part two of our sit-down interview with the

00:21:47.798 --> 00:21:50.118
<v Chris>senior directors of the Great Commission Association.

00:21:50.918 --> 00:21:55.738
<v Chris>And we're going to pick up where Pastor Chris Cole is talking about how an association,

00:21:56.218 --> 00:22:01.438
<v Chris>specifically the Great Commission Association, can help its member churches

00:22:01.438 --> 00:22:07.058
<v Chris>by being present and persistent and faithful. Here we go.

00:22:07.621 --> 00:22:13.101
<v Mike>Yeah, and that staying power that you're talking about, because we've got the

00:22:13.101 --> 00:22:15.841
<v Mike>duration with the staff and the duration of the relationships,

00:22:16.401 --> 00:22:20.561
<v Mike>pastors may come for 18 months or they may be here for 20 years or 30 years.

00:22:20.701 --> 00:22:23.301
<v Mike>We have a couple of pastors that are approaching that, right?

00:22:23.741 --> 00:22:29.361
<v Mike>But the association is here, even as those pastoral transitions keep going.

00:22:29.501 --> 00:22:34.521
<v Mike>It is a stabilizing force in the life of the church. When they're doing great,

00:22:34.681 --> 00:22:36.861
<v Mike>we celebrate with them. We try to encourage them.

00:22:37.001 --> 00:22:41.681
<v Mike>We try to mobilize them. When they're struggling, we try to move them forward.

00:22:42.061 --> 00:22:45.841
<v Chase>A couple of things. If you're a legitimate leader who cares about fulfilling

00:22:45.841 --> 00:22:50.561
<v Chase>the Great Commission into every people group in this region of California,

00:22:50.741 --> 00:22:52.121
<v Chase>well, your one church can't do it.

00:22:52.661 --> 00:22:55.961
<v Chase>You don't really have a strategy. You have a strategy of how to do your church,

00:22:56.041 --> 00:22:57.061
<v Chase>and we pray that that goes well.

00:22:57.161 --> 00:23:01.041
<v Chase>But what's the strategy for the 25 different people groups that live within

00:23:01.041 --> 00:23:04.481
<v Chase>five miles of your church? That has to be done in partnership networks.

00:23:04.721 --> 00:23:11.341
<v Chase>And we're a biblical, passionate, desiring network of churches that the most

00:23:11.341 --> 00:23:13.581
<v Chase>exciting thing for us to do is have someone walk in and say,

00:23:13.661 --> 00:23:17.241
<v Chase>hey, we want to plant a church to reach this people group that's under reach.

00:23:17.261 --> 00:23:18.941
<v Chase>And all of our churches are on board.

00:23:19.061 --> 00:23:22.261
<v Chase>Everybody's excited about it. So if you're a leader that has a legitimate concern

00:23:22.261 --> 00:23:25.801
<v Chase>of the Great Commission being fulfilled outside of your own church context,

00:23:26.101 --> 00:23:30.081
<v Chase>then you have to partner with something like GCA.

00:23:30.081 --> 00:23:35.141
<v Chase>And we invite anybody who has that heart to join with us, and let's push it forward together.

00:23:35.461 --> 00:23:40.221
<v Chase>And the second thing is, I've had multiple pastors in churches who have joined.

00:23:40.421 --> 00:23:42.861
<v Chase>They were not raised in the SBC world.

00:23:43.909 --> 00:23:46.829
<v Chase>I was raised in the SBC world. That's where I was.

00:23:47.009 --> 00:23:52.189
<v Chase>My mother had, I was on the pew, you know, two years old. So I've never known

00:23:52.189 --> 00:23:53.649
<v Chase>another structure, but they didn't.

00:23:53.769 --> 00:23:55.989
<v Chase>They came from independent or other structures.

00:23:56.769 --> 00:24:01.709
<v Chase>And most of the time when they started the relationship with us or whatever, they would do this to me.

00:24:01.989 --> 00:24:06.269
<v Chase>Like, yeah, thank you. And we appreciate your official organization called the

00:24:06.269 --> 00:24:07.949
<v Chase>GCA, but stay over there.

00:24:08.029 --> 00:24:09.789
<v Chris>Yes, stay at a distance. Yeah.

00:24:09.789 --> 00:24:14.949
<v Chase>Then crisis hit. And all churches have great days, had not so great days.

00:24:15.049 --> 00:24:17.829
<v Chase>Well, on their not so great day, when they ran out of all the options that they

00:24:17.829 --> 00:24:21.789
<v Chase>could do and the things were unraveling, it was, can you help us?

00:24:23.029 --> 00:24:27.089
<v Chase>And I said, no, because you hurt my feelings when you fish me away.

00:24:27.609 --> 00:24:32.089
<v Chase>And until you make me feel better. No, of course, you are a member of church.

00:24:32.229 --> 00:24:34.029
<v Chase>And so I would get into help.

00:24:34.209 --> 00:24:42.449
<v Chase>And then a year later, the pastor would tell me, I should have gotten you involved a lot earlier.

00:24:43.009 --> 00:24:47.369
<v Chase>But he didn't know that he could trust us earlier. He had to wait for the crisis,

00:24:47.369 --> 00:24:49.109
<v Chase>and then there were no other options.

00:24:49.289 --> 00:24:51.709
<v Chase>God left him, except, well, you're going to have to trust somebody.

00:24:51.869 --> 00:24:57.349
<v Chase>And I was just at a 25th anniversary of a church, and they actually 25 years

00:24:57.349 --> 00:25:01.249
<v Chase>ago, when they established that they had me on the program to preach, I preached something.

00:25:01.429 --> 00:25:04.809
<v Chase>It was amazing, I'm sure. But I preached something.

00:25:05.369 --> 00:25:09.229
<v Chase>But it was the and the church flourished and 25 years later in their anniversary

00:25:09.229 --> 00:25:10.789
<v Chase>they wanted me to come back

00:25:11.209 --> 00:25:15.409
<v Chase>and preach again and that was such an honor but they said to me when I showed

00:25:15.409 --> 00:25:19.369
<v Chase>up at the banquet the pastor came over and he laid his hands on my shoulder

00:25:19.369 --> 00:25:21.569
<v Chase>and he said to me I want to thank you

00:25:22.457 --> 00:25:25.917
<v Chase>You have every time we have called, you have come.

00:25:27.137 --> 00:25:33.897
<v Chase>And I don't know another way to do ministry except to come when God calls.

00:25:34.037 --> 00:25:35.417
<v Chase>But to him, it was significant.

00:25:35.737 --> 00:25:39.957
<v Chase>And to me, it was just a beautiful word of encouragement.

00:25:40.257 --> 00:25:44.657
<v Chase>You want that kind of partnership or people around your ministry?

00:25:44.657 --> 00:25:49.077
<v Chase>It's not an organization. It's people around you. Ministry is people.

00:25:49.797 --> 00:25:53.397
<v Chase>And it's having somebody I can call, even when I know they're going to tell

00:25:53.397 --> 00:25:58.197
<v Chase>me, well, that may not have been the best thing to do, but we're still here with you. Yeah. Yeah.

00:25:58.537 --> 00:26:02.917
<v Chris>Well, I'm going to ask an unscripted question. Then I'm going to ask a scripted question.

00:26:03.097 --> 00:26:05.857
<v Chris>And I'll set up my unscripted question with a bit of a story.

00:26:06.037 --> 00:26:10.897
<v Chris>When I was a young pastor in my 20s, went to a prayer meeting in the Deep South

00:26:10.897 --> 00:26:14.357
<v Chris>with a bunch of black pastors and white pastors at the time,

00:26:14.497 --> 00:26:18.797
<v Chris>very few Hispanic pastors or Asian pastors in that particular group I knew.

00:26:18.797 --> 00:26:20.737
<v Chris>But there was about 80 of us.

00:26:20.937 --> 00:26:25.477
<v Chris>And there were young black pastors and young white pastors. I was part of that

00:26:25.477 --> 00:26:28.857
<v Chris>group. And there was older white pastors and older black pastors.

00:26:29.057 --> 00:26:32.217
<v Chris>And there was a worship gathering at a prayer thing.

00:26:32.517 --> 00:26:36.417
<v Chris>And somehow, some way, and a bunch of us were astonished at this,

00:26:36.857 --> 00:26:43.537
<v Chris>the older white pastors and the older black pastors got into a big argument about the music.

00:26:43.997 --> 00:26:50.637
<v Chris>And it got intense. And the younger guys, maybe under 35, all of us,

00:26:50.777 --> 00:26:55.857
<v Chris>white and black, we just kind of slunk out of the room and we went and played ping pong together.

00:26:55.997 --> 00:26:58.157
<v Chris>And we were like, what is that all about?

00:26:58.357 --> 00:27:02.217
<v Chris>And I say that to set up what is something that's very controversial in the

00:27:02.217 --> 00:27:05.617
<v Chris>church, not so much in California, but the concept of diversity.

00:27:05.817 --> 00:27:10.997
<v Chris>One of the things I am just grateful as I can be about with the Great Commission

00:27:10.997 --> 00:27:15.517
<v Chris>Association is how diverse we are.

00:27:15.717 --> 00:27:19.597
<v Chris>It's fantastic. It's a great microcosm of the body of Christ.

00:27:19.957 --> 00:27:26.277
<v Chris>But we don't talk about it. There's not like a diversity initiative or all of this kind of thing.

00:27:26.417 --> 00:27:31.677
<v Chris>And I guess my question to you guys is, how did we get so diverse? It's where we live.

00:27:32.117 --> 00:27:36.877
<v Se J>Yeah. Our communities. This is who we are. This is where we are, the people around us.

00:27:37.517 --> 00:27:42.437
<v Se J>California and especially Bay Area has become the

00:27:43.190 --> 00:27:46.710
<v Se J>epicenter for global, everybody coming from all over the world.

00:27:47.230 --> 00:27:51.710
<v Chase>Our churches made us diverse. The churches that joined us and said,

00:27:51.850 --> 00:27:57.710
<v Chase>we're going to be on partner with you, all of them, they came in and they wanted to do the work.

00:27:57.810 --> 00:28:03.710
<v Chase>So it wasn't us who made GCA diverse. It was God's churches, God's people.

00:28:04.350 --> 00:28:10.170
<v Chase>And it's wonderful. It's wonderful. I, you know, all of them had,

00:28:10.290 --> 00:28:14.610
<v Chase>every culture has a different way to make a decision, but all of them in our

00:28:14.610 --> 00:28:17.250
<v Chase>churches want to make a godly decision. Amen.

00:28:17.550 --> 00:28:22.250
<v Chase>And they want support. So we're just blessed that we get to be with these kinds of churches.

00:28:22.430 --> 00:28:25.530
<v Chase>And, you know, they serve all of

00:28:25.530 --> 00:28:28.410
<v Chase>our churches. They serve on our executive board. They serve in officers.

00:28:28.610 --> 00:28:33.210
<v Chase>You can see throughout the years, they're willing to do it. They're willing to serve God.

00:28:33.790 --> 00:28:40.010
<v Chase>So, no, that's not an issue that—it's not even an issue we really talk about

00:28:40.010 --> 00:28:42.750
<v Chase>or worry about because our pastors can see themselves.

00:28:44.054 --> 00:28:48.854
<v Chase>In the leaders and the board and what we do. They see their churches.

00:28:49.034 --> 00:28:54.054
<v Chase>In fact, we ask every church to serve, and they all get an opportunity to serve

00:28:54.054 --> 00:28:56.014
<v Chase>in leading the association.

00:28:56.254 --> 00:28:58.674
<v Chase>It's up to them if they want to accept the responsibility.

00:28:59.514 --> 00:29:03.554
<v Mike>I think environmentally, you know, we have a bit of uniqueness.

00:29:03.554 --> 00:29:08.254
<v Mike>If you were in more of a monocultural state, you're in central Iowa,

00:29:08.914 --> 00:29:13.014
<v Mike>for example, you're probably not going to get as much diversity within your

00:29:13.014 --> 00:29:15.514
<v Mike>church. It's just simply because that's not in your population.

00:29:16.114 --> 00:29:21.814
<v Mike>66% of the tech workers in Silicon Valley were born outside the United States.

00:29:22.494 --> 00:29:24.394
<v Chris>That's another astonishing number. Right.

00:29:24.614 --> 00:29:24.894
<v Se J>Two thumbs.

00:29:25.434 --> 00:29:29.634
<v Mike>And, you know, we go all the way from highly educated communities in Silicon

00:29:29.634 --> 00:29:34.114
<v Mike>Valley down to very agricultural communities like your community, Salinas.

00:29:34.334 --> 00:29:37.274
<v Mike>We have communities just south of Salinas like Greenfield.

00:29:37.594 --> 00:29:43.554
<v Mike>Population is approximately 95% Hispanic, a little bit more actually probably in Greenfield.

00:29:43.834 --> 00:29:48.734
<v Mike>Right there. So you have that great diversity. So the responsibility of the

00:29:48.734 --> 00:29:52.914
<v Mike>Great Commission is to reach the people that are where you are at.

00:29:53.074 --> 00:29:57.994
<v Mike>And even though Southern Baptists have our own history that has real challenges

00:29:57.994 --> 00:30:04.294
<v Mike>with going far enough back with how we approach different races and different communities,

00:30:04.514 --> 00:30:09.954
<v Mike>the reality is that we've also got a history as Southern Baptists of being very missional people.

00:30:09.954 --> 00:30:12.834
<v Mike>Whether it's through the North American Mission Board's initiatives,

00:30:13.527 --> 00:30:20.767
<v Mike>And their desire to reach the peoples of different communities or current initiatives

00:30:20.767 --> 00:30:24.347
<v Mike>that come through the association, partnerships that we have.

00:30:24.527 --> 00:30:27.467
<v Mike>We identify unreached people groups that live in the Bay Area.

00:30:27.647 --> 00:30:30.287
<v Mike>We've been working in the past couple of years, for example,

00:30:30.547 --> 00:30:34.827
<v Mike>trying to help reach the Uyghur people in the Bay Area. We have an Afghan-American

00:30:34.827 --> 00:30:38.987
<v Mike>church. We have an Ethiopian church. We have a Slavic church.

00:30:39.007 --> 00:30:45.427
<v Mike>We have many Chinese churches, Korean churches, South Asian churches.

00:30:45.567 --> 00:30:50.527
<v Mike>We could just keep on going in addition to having majority groups like Hispanic

00:30:50.527 --> 00:30:52.227
<v Mike>churches and English language churches.

00:30:52.714 --> 00:30:55.974
<v Mike>So our churches have driven some of that diversity.

00:30:56.254 --> 00:30:59.794
<v Mike>And then if you're in an association and every church gets to serve,

00:30:59.954 --> 00:31:02.874
<v Mike>like on our executive board, they're going to make decisions and they're going

00:31:02.874 --> 00:31:07.374
<v Mike>to have to get into a room together and dialogue together with that diversity.

00:31:07.374 --> 00:31:09.594
<v Mike>And they all have that heart.

00:31:09.794 --> 00:31:13.854
<v Mike>So you see, you know, Hispanic pastors in our churches and our associations

00:31:13.854 --> 00:31:17.774
<v Mike>serving on our executive board that want us to reach Uyghur people,

00:31:18.214 --> 00:31:19.954
<v Mike>which is a beautiful thing.

00:31:19.954 --> 00:31:27.394
<v Mike>And you have Chinese language pastors that are working to see other people groups come to faith.

00:31:27.854 --> 00:31:31.614
<v Mike>One of our Chinese churches is a great example. They're working very much in

00:31:31.614 --> 00:31:33.834
<v Mike>partnership with our Afghan outreach,

00:31:33.834 --> 00:31:38.694
<v Mike>which is amazing to see that kind of engagement cross-culturally.

00:31:39.114 --> 00:31:40.834
<v Mike>And that's their heartbeat.

00:31:40.834 --> 00:31:46.554
<v Chris>So I was born in the 70s. This was after the thrust of the civil rights movement in the South.

00:31:46.714 --> 00:31:51.814
<v Chris>But the churches there in most of my lifetime were quite segregated,

00:31:52.074 --> 00:31:55.934
<v Chris>even though I would say racial relations are better.

00:31:55.934 --> 00:32:05.054
<v Chris>But coming from that landscape that is slowly desegregating in the church into what we have here,

00:32:05.314 --> 00:32:11.014
<v Chris>which is beautiful diversity in, I guess, a non-woke sort of way,

00:32:11.154 --> 00:32:13.334
<v Chris>it's just been so refreshing for me.

00:32:13.334 --> 00:32:21.874
<v Chase>Yeah. And it's also gospel-centric. All of our churches here are actually theologically, I would say,

00:32:22.034 --> 00:32:28.874
<v Chase>more concerned about being biblically correct and biblically driven than in a lot of places.

00:32:28.894 --> 00:32:33.774
<v Chase>Because here, in California, you have to choose you want to follow God.

00:32:33.774 --> 00:32:35.534
<v Chase>It's not the cool thing to do.

00:32:35.714 --> 00:32:39.894
<v Chase>My whole time here, theological issues being a

00:32:40.309 --> 00:32:43.349
<v Chase>has not we've not we've not lost one church due

00:32:43.349 --> 00:32:46.209
<v Chase>to theological issues that i can recall at this moment

00:32:46.209 --> 00:32:49.229
<v Chase>so that has not been their issues it's been the normal things

00:32:49.229 --> 00:32:54.429
<v Chase>that churches faces unity crisis uh leadership uh those kind of things so that's

00:32:54.429 --> 00:32:58.849
<v Chase>it's beautiful diversity who we are but our commitment to scripture commitment

00:32:58.849 --> 00:33:04.449
<v Chase>to the the gospel that of jesus that he's the only one that saves that's intact

00:33:04.449 --> 00:33:07.129
<v Chase>i mean that's really really strong and among our churches

00:33:07.865 --> 00:33:11.345
<v Chris>Pastor Chris, earlier you gave a statistic, kind of blew my mind,

00:33:11.765 --> 00:33:14.845
<v Chris>18 months tenure for the average pastor.

00:33:14.985 --> 00:33:20.505
<v Chris>I'll give you one maybe that you guys don't know, that Salinas and Bakersfield

00:33:20.505 --> 00:33:24.465
<v Chris>are two of the least educated cities in the entire United States.

00:33:24.785 --> 00:33:30.105
<v Chris>San Jose is top five educated cities in the United States, you know, depending on the year.

00:33:30.545 --> 00:33:34.625
<v Chris>And Salinas and San Jose, like an hour away from each other.

00:33:34.625 --> 00:33:39.385
<v Chris>So, in our association, we have this microcosm of, as you said,

00:33:39.465 --> 00:33:44.265
<v Chris>just incredibly diverse educationally, thinking about the association,

00:33:44.525 --> 00:33:47.445
<v Chris>looking forward into the future, forecasting prophetically.

00:33:47.785 --> 00:33:50.045
<v Chris>It doesn't have to be prophetically. It could be strategically.

00:33:50.905 --> 00:33:52.945
<v Mike>We have a word. Just a word from the Lord.

00:33:53.085 --> 00:33:58.425
<v Chris>I will spend some time in a we have a word church. Those were interesting days.

00:33:58.585 --> 00:33:59.785
<v Chase>There's only more than one of them.

00:34:00.665 --> 00:34:04.105
<v Chris>There's a lot of them. And if you have a word, feel free to share it.

00:34:04.105 --> 00:34:07.225
<v Chris>I mean, the first credit deal is 12 or 14. I'm all about it.

00:34:07.605 --> 00:34:11.805
<v Chris>But forecasting, where do you see the GCA?

00:34:12.145 --> 00:34:14.725
<v Chris>Not this year. Let's look a little bit further into the future.

00:34:15.025 --> 00:34:20.965
<v Chris>2027, 2028, 2029, as we head into the tail years of the 2020s,

00:34:21.045 --> 00:34:23.465
<v Chris>where are we going forecast wise?

00:34:23.685 --> 00:34:27.425
<v Se J>I think Dr. Stewart probably needs to start this with this transition.

00:34:28.865 --> 00:34:35.045
<v Se J>At least forecasting that we will have a new executive director installed in a couple of years.

00:34:36.825 --> 00:34:45.225
<v Se J>Wanting to see how we go forward from that will be sort of the marker for next 10, 20 years.

00:34:45.385 --> 00:34:50.045
<v Se J>But from my seat, from the operations side, I think a couple of things that

00:34:50.045 --> 00:34:55.225
<v Se J>we would like to see is we've been growing, building, stabilizing as much as we can.

00:34:56.028 --> 00:35:03.008
<v Se J>But I think we need to do some shoring up of our processes and our structure

00:35:03.008 --> 00:35:08.888
<v Se J>systems because we've been growing and we've been growing ever since I got here.

00:35:08.988 --> 00:35:12.928
<v Se J>I think we doubled, maybe more than that, as far as not only number of schools,

00:35:12.968 --> 00:35:14.988
<v Se J>but also in budget and everything else.

00:35:15.128 --> 00:35:19.108
<v Se J>And so we need to build a right infrastructure or systems so that we could do

00:35:19.108 --> 00:35:20.648
<v Se J>more. I think that's one.

00:35:20.868 --> 00:35:24.808
<v Se J>We need to focus really on developing next-generation leaders.

00:35:25.548 --> 00:35:28.168
<v Se J>Because I always thought I was young.

00:35:29.748 --> 00:35:30.948
<v Chris>But you are.

00:35:31.588 --> 00:35:39.068
<v Se J>Youngest in this group, yes. But I think we need to eventually and perhaps strategically

00:35:39.068 --> 00:35:43.908
<v Se J>develop next-generation leaders, not just for us here, but also for our churches. We're

00:35:44.712 --> 00:35:49.492
<v Se J>We are in dire need of that. So that's what, if I could put my two cents,

00:35:49.692 --> 00:35:54.352
<v Se J>those should be one systemized and then really develop leaders.

00:35:54.952 --> 00:36:00.592
<v Chris>Yeah, that's so important. Our deacons right now at our church are putting a

00:36:00.592 --> 00:36:03.592
<v Chris>guy in his 20s through the deacon process.

00:36:03.892 --> 00:36:07.712
<v Chris>And it's these, the guys that are spearheading that, that wanted to make it

00:36:07.712 --> 00:36:16.332
<v Chris>happen, are in their 60s and 70s. And they want to see these new young leaders rise up and flourish.

00:36:16.612 --> 00:36:23.252
<v Chase>I think for the next two years, what I see ahead for GCA is there's a lot of promise.

00:36:23.412 --> 00:36:25.852
<v Chase>There's a lot of promise and there's a lot of responsibility.

00:36:26.232 --> 00:36:30.232
<v Chase>It's challenging out there in the ministry field. It's challenging for organizations

00:36:30.232 --> 00:36:34.972
<v Chase>like associations and networks of churches because as we talked about COVID

00:36:34.972 --> 00:36:38.572
<v Chase>of impacting churches and destabilizing a lot of them.

00:36:38.572 --> 00:36:42.332
<v Chase>Well, a lot of those used to be your strong supporters of other networks,

00:36:42.452 --> 00:36:43.332
<v Chase>your association stuff.

00:36:43.592 --> 00:36:48.272
<v Chase>Well, as they destabilize, so does your structure, which GCA,

00:36:48.672 --> 00:36:54.772
<v Chase>by God's grace, we have a lot of resources. We have talent that loves God,

00:36:54.872 --> 00:36:57.772
<v Chase>loves to churches, and we have our pastors who are united.

00:36:58.012 --> 00:36:59.892
<v Chase>But there's responsibility ahead.

00:37:00.192 --> 00:37:05.932
<v Chase>And GCA has to seriously weigh through what is our place in the future mission

00:37:05.932 --> 00:37:10.532
<v Chase>world in this part of California. So that's something that we have to wrestle.

00:37:10.652 --> 00:37:14.112
<v Chase>I think there's more responsibility ahead for GCA.

00:37:14.492 --> 00:37:21.432
<v Chase>And I also think there's great promise because of just the kind of people that are serving at GCA.

00:37:21.752 --> 00:37:25.132
<v Chase>So I think we'll be stronger. I think we'll have more responsibility.

00:37:25.132 --> 00:37:31.092
<v Chase>I think God will send an executive director of missions who can—we pray that

00:37:31.092 --> 00:37:36.812
<v Chase>he is someone that can appreciate and evaluate what's really here as a gift from God,

00:37:36.852 --> 00:37:42.932
<v Chase>but also will not take this as a promotion, but as an assignment to enter into

00:37:42.932 --> 00:37:45.352
<v Chase>a greater work for the kingdom of God.

00:37:46.188 --> 00:37:52.088
<v Chris>Amen. It's such a strategic time, too, with the CSBC, California Southern Baptists,

00:37:52.248 --> 00:37:55.388
<v Chris>moving their epicenter more south.

00:37:56.248 --> 00:38:00.408
<v Chris>There's going to be great need for Baptists in the north, as you say.

00:38:01.568 --> 00:38:08.008
<v Chris>California is a long state. There's going to be need for associations to rise

00:38:08.008 --> 00:38:10.788
<v Chris>up, especially in northern California, the NorCal area.

00:38:10.788 --> 00:38:16.188
<v Chris>I think that the responsibility, the responsibility in creating the leaders,

00:38:16.488 --> 00:38:20.808
<v Chris>the upcoming leaders, it's going to be an undertaking.

00:38:20.808 --> 00:38:23.248
<v Chase>But it's going to be timely.

00:38:23.568 --> 00:38:25.028
<v Chris>It's going to be very timely.

00:38:25.028 --> 00:38:30.728
<v Chase>Well, and I would say we have to come alongside churches. They have the leaders.

00:38:30.928 --> 00:38:34.868
<v Chase>Yes. But if we can help that pastor or leadership group think through,

00:38:35.308 --> 00:38:40.408
<v Chase>and we've done that through GCTI, here are avenues to help you develop leaders

00:38:40.408 --> 00:38:43.508
<v Chase>in a practical way. And that's what Matt's team has been talking about.

00:38:43.668 --> 00:38:47.608
<v Chase>How do we practically move the leaders that are inside of our churches,

00:38:47.608 --> 00:38:50.248
<v Chase>the deacons, the governing boards, whatever we have?

00:38:50.368 --> 00:38:54.868
<v Chase>But we don't create leaders and we don't elevate leaders.

00:38:55.028 --> 00:39:00.848
<v Chase>That's the church, but we can help the church do that as a partner with it.

00:39:01.268 --> 00:39:04.708
<v Mike>Yeah, in addition to everything that they're sharing, which I would amen,

00:39:04.708 --> 00:39:09.968
<v Mike>I would say that for the next two years, at least from the mission advance team

00:39:09.968 --> 00:39:15.008
<v Mike>perspective, we're going to really focus on being strategically driven.

00:39:15.635 --> 00:39:21.675
<v Mike>We're going to have very strong emphasis on us fulfilling a strategy of equipping

00:39:21.675 --> 00:39:26.695
<v Mike>and training and helping churches work through their own assessments as they

00:39:26.695 --> 00:39:29.315
<v Mike>work to develop leaders, all of those pieces.

00:39:29.495 --> 00:39:33.155
<v Mike>We're going to be equipping them, doing that relationally. So I think focus

00:39:33.155 --> 00:39:36.635
<v Mike>is a big thing. I think community is going to expand.

00:39:36.955 --> 00:39:43.955
<v Mike>I think the reality of regionalized associations, that day is passing.

00:39:43.955 --> 00:39:45.395
<v Mike>I'm not saying it's passed.

00:39:45.635 --> 00:39:53.135
<v Mike>But regionalized associations being geographically defined or exclusively geographically

00:39:53.135 --> 00:39:55.455
<v Mike>defined or primarily geographically defined,

00:39:55.655 --> 00:40:01.055
<v Mike>that day is passing and we're going to be inviting people into partnership on

00:40:01.055 --> 00:40:04.195
<v Mike>a broader level than we ever have before.

00:40:04.195 --> 00:40:09.295
<v Mike>We're already experiencing that. We've got partners helping replant a church

00:40:09.295 --> 00:40:14.475
<v Mike>in the Silicon Valley heartbeat of Silicon Valley that are partners that are

00:40:14.475 --> 00:40:20.975
<v Mike>from Texas and Oklahoma and Georgia and Oregon.

00:40:21.315 --> 00:40:26.175
<v Mike>And, you know, it's just crazy. So I think we're going to be inviting more people

00:40:26.175 --> 00:40:28.535
<v Mike>to be on mission together with us,

00:40:28.655 --> 00:40:33.495
<v Mike>whether that's local churches joining the association or other networks or other

00:40:33.495 --> 00:40:36.475
<v Mike>associations, we're going to be partnering together more.

00:40:36.655 --> 00:40:41.575
<v Mike>So I think that partnership is going to expand, community is going to expand

00:40:41.575 --> 00:40:44.915
<v Mike>in some really neat and exciting ways.

00:40:44.915 --> 00:40:49.715
<v Mike>And that will, of course, bring about its own set of challenges as well.

00:40:49.715 --> 00:40:56.375
<v Mike>But I think the emphasis on us helping churches do that well with each other

00:40:56.375 --> 00:41:00.735
<v Mike>in our association and expanding those networks out is something that we anticipate

00:41:00.735 --> 00:41:02.775
<v Mike>is coming in that we're working very hard towards.

00:41:03.392 --> 00:41:06.532
<v Chris>Yeah. So I didn't grow up wanting to be a pastor.

00:41:06.732 --> 00:41:12.612
<v Chris>I wanted to be an FBI agent. And so I got kind of thrown into the whole youth pastor thing in my 20s.

00:41:12.732 --> 00:41:16.032
<v Chris>And definitely I was called by God.

00:41:16.192 --> 00:41:19.492
<v Chris>But, you know, I went to seminary. I didn't know what I was doing.

00:41:19.792 --> 00:41:24.852
<v Chris>Seminary doesn't always prepare you to pastor. and a group of older pastors,

00:41:25.052 --> 00:41:28.812
<v Chris>a coalition, took me and some other youth ministers in and we basically formed

00:41:28.812 --> 00:41:30.392
<v Chris>our own little association.

00:41:30.392 --> 00:41:35.572
<v Chris>I say that to say, if you're a young leader in a church or a pastor,

00:41:35.752 --> 00:41:37.392
<v Chris>youth pastor, deacon or whatever,

00:41:37.732 --> 00:41:40.892
<v Chris>and you're looking for togetherness, that's one of the reasons,

00:41:41.192 --> 00:41:45.932
<v Chris>the whole reasons that Chris and I are putting together the show and the GCA

00:41:45.932 --> 00:41:49.552
<v Chris>is running with it is because we want to make those connections.

00:41:49.692 --> 00:41:53.812
<v Chris>And so I want to just say, there's an open door for you if you're listening

00:41:53.812 --> 00:41:55.332
<v Chris>to this and you want partnership.

00:41:55.672 --> 00:41:59.752
<v Chris>You can contact us through our website, through the GCASBC website.

00:42:00.052 --> 00:42:06.652
<v Chris>We want to partner with you, and I think you will find a home here if you're looking.

00:42:07.132 --> 00:42:10.652
<v Mike>Absolutely. And to that end, as we think about equipping leaders,

00:42:10.912 --> 00:42:17.052
<v Mike>real quick, what's one resource that you found encouraging in the past year

00:42:17.052 --> 00:42:20.672
<v Mike>or two that you just like to hand off to someone, that you say,

00:42:21.012 --> 00:42:24.712
<v Mike>hey, this is a resource, this is a tool, this is something that's encouraged

00:42:24.712 --> 00:42:27.192
<v Mike>my life or it's encouraged me in leadership,

00:42:28.192 --> 00:42:32.372
<v Mike>maybe in one minute or less, because I know our time is getting short here.

00:42:32.632 --> 00:42:35.872
<v Mike>What's one resource that you would hand off to a leader and just say,

00:42:35.972 --> 00:42:39.532
<v Mike>I think this will encourage you, this will equip you, this will strengthen you

00:42:39.532 --> 00:42:43.692
<v Mike>in your leadership, in your growing, your faith, your walk with Christ?

00:42:43.692 --> 00:42:50.312
<v Se J>I think adding on to our previous conversation, one of the aspects that we need

00:42:50.312 --> 00:42:53.132
<v Se J>to hone in on is our spiritual relationship.

00:42:53.697 --> 00:42:59.677
<v Se J>Realities, and our spiritual vitality in our churches, ourselves individually,

00:43:00.037 --> 00:43:02.257
<v Se J>as an association, pastors all across.

00:43:02.677 --> 00:43:07.737
<v Se J>And I think the prayer movement, and again, this has been used so many ways,

00:43:07.897 --> 00:43:09.697
<v Se J>and so it may be a separate podcast,

00:43:09.877 --> 00:43:14.757
<v Se J>but I think there is a great need for spiritual renewal and awakening.

00:43:15.177 --> 00:43:19.857
<v Se J>So for us to see something that can't be explained by numbers or logic,

00:43:21.097 --> 00:43:25.097
<v Se J>For us to see God move in such a way that we could only say that was God.

00:43:25.357 --> 00:43:31.017
<v Se J>And so I think that's an area that I would like to see and all of us would like

00:43:31.017 --> 00:43:37.197
<v Se J>to see that more and how we work as a team here, but also with our pastors to really start,

00:43:37.417 --> 00:43:40.937
<v Se J>hey, let's lean into that because that's really significant.

00:43:41.157 --> 00:43:46.137
<v Se J>And I would say for that, Daniel Henderson's book for me was very helpful, Old Path, New Power.

00:43:46.417 --> 00:43:51.877
<v Se J>I think that would be very helpful. 21 days of prayer campaigns Across personally

00:43:51.877 --> 00:43:54.117
<v Se J>I still do it personally I think

00:43:54.117 --> 00:44:00.157
<v Se J>those will be very crucial For us I believe if I'm not right with God

00:44:01.117 --> 00:44:05.377
<v Se J>What I do really doesn't matter And you know God can certainly do And he could

00:44:05.377 --> 00:44:11.457
<v Se J>use a donkey to do his work But I wouldn't be able to witness What he's doing

00:44:11.457 --> 00:44:15.577
<v Se J>if I'm not with him And so that's one of the main things I would suggest

00:44:16.707 --> 00:44:20.947
<v Chase>My daughter just gave me a book that is kind of blowing my mind. It's by John Eldridge.

00:44:21.127 --> 00:44:26.447
<v Chase>It's a book he wrote 14 years ago called Waking the Dead, The Glory of a Heart Fully Alive.

00:44:28.427 --> 00:44:35.347
<v Chase>And that's an awesome book. It kind of is on that path, but it's really, it's incredible.

00:44:35.867 --> 00:44:41.187
<v Chase>For me, it's been an incredible read. I'm reading it with my adult son, and it's a blessing.

00:44:41.187 --> 00:44:48.367
<v Chris>For me, I would encourage staff members or even anyone listening to this to

00:44:48.367 --> 00:44:51.027
<v Chris>become intentionally involved in your church.

00:44:51.767 --> 00:44:54.487
<v Chase>Become in a ministry,

00:44:54.887 --> 00:44:59.407
<v Chris>Sharing your giftings with others, leading out a ministry.

00:44:59.407 --> 00:45:02.587
<v Chase>And also for me,

00:45:02.747 --> 00:45:08.327
<v Chris>Even in women's fellowship and stepping out into places that might be uncomfortable

00:45:08.327 --> 00:45:13.927
<v Chris>for you to allow God to help you to grow so that you could show others that

00:45:13.927 --> 00:45:17.047
<v Chris>it's okay to step out on faith and to be nervous about it.

00:45:17.167 --> 00:45:21.567
<v Chris>That's really helped my growth this year in the church.

00:45:22.387 --> 00:45:28.367
<v Mike>I think one thing that I would add to that is that as leaders come up,

00:45:28.487 --> 00:45:35.327
<v Mike>one of the things we fail to realize is that who we are matters in many ways more than what we do.

00:45:35.627 --> 00:45:39.327
<v Mike>And if we don't have a good sense of not only our relationship with Christ,

00:45:39.507 --> 00:45:44.067
<v Mike>but who we are in ourselves and how we interact with other people,

00:45:44.247 --> 00:45:50.647
<v Mike>that becomes such a critical reality for what we can do in the kingdom of God.

00:45:50.647 --> 00:45:56.207
<v Mike>And so I think any of the amazing resources, and there's a lot out there along

00:45:56.207 --> 00:46:01.267
<v Mike>that line, I would just think of two that come to mind immediately are Steve

00:46:01.267 --> 00:46:03.487
<v Mike>Cuss's Managing Leadership Anxiety,

00:46:03.847 --> 00:46:06.327
<v Mike>Yours and Theirs is the subtitle.

00:46:06.327 --> 00:46:10.627
<v Mike>And it talks about how leaders very often are transmitting anxiety into group

00:46:10.627 --> 00:46:12.627
<v Mike>situations, and they're failing

00:46:12.627 --> 00:46:17.427
<v Mike>to lead well because they've not addressed their own internal fears,

00:46:17.647 --> 00:46:21.527
<v Mike>insecurities, and doubts, which, by the way, ties in really well into John Eldridge's

00:46:21.527 --> 00:46:23.727
<v Mike>book on being fully alive to God.

00:46:23.727 --> 00:46:27.487
<v Mike>Or Peter Scazzaro's Emotionally Healthy Leadership.

00:46:27.567 --> 00:46:31.887
<v Mike>He's got a great book, Emotionally Healthy Spirituality, Emotionally Healthy Leadership.

00:46:31.887 --> 00:46:36.947
<v Mike>The idea of who you are as a leader is a reflection of your own relationship

00:46:36.947 --> 00:46:41.347
<v Mike>to God and your own ability to manage your own fears, doubts,

00:46:41.527 --> 00:46:43.847
<v Mike>anxieties, and weaknesses. Both those would be fantastic.

00:46:44.027 --> 00:46:47.067
<v Chase>Yeah, I'm writing my own book, though. It's called Emotional Leadership.

00:46:48.887 --> 00:46:51.947
<v Chase>I'm almost got it done, but I keep ripping it up at the last time.

00:46:54.307 --> 00:46:55.487
<v Chris>Fantastic. All right.

00:46:55.767 --> 00:47:01.867
<v Se J>One more, and I would say, because I think many people go through unknown pains,

00:47:02.587 --> 00:47:08.767
<v Se J>unknown trials, challenges that they can't talk about or say out loud or people to know.

00:47:09.547 --> 00:47:14.087
<v Se J>I did a study with one of my group in Beijing,

00:47:14.951 --> 00:47:19.951
<v Se J>Gift of Pain by Dr. Par Brand and Philip Yancey, co-author.

00:47:20.271 --> 00:47:25.711
<v Se J>I think that helped me understand pain is not a curse.

00:47:26.171 --> 00:47:30.771
<v Se J>Yeah. And so I think I would recommend that book from anybody listening that's

00:47:30.771 --> 00:47:32.731
<v Se J>going through unknown and hidden problems.

00:47:32.992 --> 00:47:36.552
<v Se J>Hurts, pains, challenges. This book is good.

00:47:36.992 --> 00:47:40.932
<v Chris>Fantastic. You have recommended resources that I'm not familiar with.

00:47:41.072 --> 00:47:46.052
<v Chris>So if you're listening and you're also not familiar with and you want to remember these, don't worry.

00:47:46.212 --> 00:47:50.732
<v Chris>We'll have them on our website, everychurchflourishing.com under the show notes

00:47:50.732 --> 00:47:53.572
<v Chris>for this episode, also under our resources page.

00:47:53.852 --> 00:47:57.912
<v Chris>And if you want to check these resources out, we don't get a commission or anything like that.

00:47:58.052 --> 00:48:02.452
<v Chris>We're just recommending stuff that would be good and healthy for your spiritual walk.

00:48:02.572 --> 00:48:07.252
<v Chris>I'll give one that's free and it's not a book resource, but our church has really,

00:48:07.392 --> 00:48:12.972
<v Chris>the last few years since COVID hit, emphasized the whole Robert Murray McShane

00:48:12.972 --> 00:48:17.392
<v Chris>reading scripture together on a daily basis. And we're really hitting it hard this year.

00:48:17.572 --> 00:48:22.872
<v Chris>And for me, I've found a way to do that through the Bible app,

00:48:23.012 --> 00:48:28.132
<v Chris>which is free, the YouVersion Bible app. But I usually listen to my portions.

00:48:28.372 --> 00:48:33.372
<v Chris>And basically what you can do, depending on what plan you choose, is you you hit play.

00:48:33.392 --> 00:48:37.772
<v Chris>You put your earphones in or whatever and you hit play on the top passage and

00:48:37.772 --> 00:48:39.992
<v Chris>it will play through all of those passages.

00:48:39.992 --> 00:48:43.692
<v Chris>So in the morning when you're getting ready or whatever, for me today,

00:48:43.872 --> 00:48:47.392
<v Chris>when I was driving over to the GCA offices, I was finishing up my Bible reading

00:48:47.392 --> 00:48:53.032
<v Chris>on my car speakers. And it's a great way to get the word of God in on a daily basis.

00:48:53.312 --> 00:48:58.092
<v Chris>So, hey, thank you all for your time. I know that setting everybody up and thank

00:48:58.092 --> 00:49:03.252
<v Chris>you, Miss Grace, for setting us up, scheduling this and getting everybody together for you guys.

00:49:03.412 --> 00:49:06.832
<v Chris>You're incredibly busy. You have lots of responsibilities and roles.

00:49:06.832 --> 00:49:11.632
<v Chris>I appreciate you devoting the time today for us to get together in person in

00:49:11.632 --> 00:49:15.072
<v Chris>the office and record this. Thank you. Anybody have any parting shots?

00:49:15.652 --> 00:49:18.032
<v Se J>Thank you. Thank you for doing this. This is important for us.

00:49:18.432 --> 00:49:19.212
<v Chris>Oh, amen. Yeah.

00:49:19.292 --> 00:49:23.252
<v Chase>One of my two-year predictions also is that, Chase, because of your expert leadership,

00:49:23.472 --> 00:49:25.112
<v Chase>there will be 50,000 people listening.

00:49:25.472 --> 00:49:28.152
<v Chase>That will change the future of GCA.

00:49:28.532 --> 00:49:30.932
<v Chris>That would change a lot of things. That's a word.

00:49:31.192 --> 00:49:31.972
<v Mike>That's a word.

00:49:33.492 --> 00:49:36.852
<v Chris>I receive that word. I receive it. I don't know.

00:49:37.511 --> 00:49:42.691
<v Mike>We're back from that interview. Pastor Chase, I hope that was an encouragement

00:49:42.691 --> 00:49:48.471
<v Mike>to you as you sat there and did a wonderful job of helping guide us through that conversation.

00:49:48.731 --> 00:49:54.571
<v Mike>You know, I am super glad that God brought me to be a part of this amazing team.

00:49:54.951 --> 00:50:01.111
<v Mike>Each of our directors has a unique set of gifting and a unique perspective,

00:50:01.111 --> 00:50:07.351
<v Mike>but they all have a passion for the gospel of Jesus Christ being advanced throughout our region.

00:50:07.511 --> 00:50:11.971
<v Mike>And so whether we're doing operations or schools or we're helping churches figure

00:50:11.971 --> 00:50:18.631
<v Mike>out how best to do their work, then we are excited to encourage and equip one another on that team.

00:50:18.691 --> 00:50:20.971
<v Mike>And I'm glad I get to be a part of that team.

00:50:21.311 --> 00:50:27.051
<v Chris>Amen. Amen. It was it was fun. It was genuine. I think what you heard was real

00:50:27.051 --> 00:50:34.431
<v Chris>responses from real people who have a deep and abiding care for the church of

00:50:34.431 --> 00:50:37.011
<v Chris>Jesus to fulfill his great commission.

00:50:37.511 --> 00:50:42.751
<v Mike>Absolutely. Well, Pastor Chase, an association is a family of churches.

00:50:43.331 --> 00:50:47.531
<v Mike>We're a missional network of churches. We're on mission together,

00:50:47.531 --> 00:50:52.131
<v Mike>but we're also a family of churches, and we want to celebrate with our different churches.

00:50:52.491 --> 00:50:58.311
<v Mike>And we love to celebrate when churches send us word of baptism, right?

00:50:58.411 --> 00:51:03.671
<v Mike>I mean, we're Baptists, so we love it when we get to hear how churches are growing,

00:51:03.911 --> 00:51:07.091
<v Mike>how they're engaging their communities with the gospel, how they're flourishing,

00:51:07.091 --> 00:51:11.251
<v Mike>and how they're reaching people with the hope of the gospel and seeing them

00:51:11.251 --> 00:51:14.071
<v Mike>follow Jesus in obedience in baptism.

00:51:14.291 --> 00:51:19.751
<v Mike>And in 2024, your church, Valley Baptist Church of Salinas, California,

00:51:20.031 --> 00:51:24.131
<v Mike>you guys had the privilege of seeing 16 people baptized.

00:51:24.131 --> 00:51:31.131
<v Mike>And you're a very normative-sized congregation. You're not a congregation of 5,000 people.

00:51:32.011 --> 00:51:37.231
<v Mike>And this was an amazing time and an encouraging time, I know, for you. So,

00:51:37.818 --> 00:51:42.318
<v Mike>how did that happen? How did this come about?

00:51:42.498 --> 00:51:47.438
<v Mike>And what words would you share as an encouragement to other pastors out there

00:51:47.438 --> 00:51:52.818
<v Mike>who are praying for and seeking this kind of a movement of God amongst their church?

00:51:52.998 --> 00:51:55.738
<v Chris>So let me pull back the curtain a little bit and just say,

00:51:56.219 --> 00:52:01.639
<v Chris>I requested we do this segment. And you probably think it's so I could toot

00:52:01.639 --> 00:52:06.639
<v Chris>my own horn or aggrandize and brag about Valley Baptist Church.

00:52:06.779 --> 00:52:11.059
<v Chris>But here's the thing. I've been in ministry for 30 years and I've been pastoring

00:52:11.059 --> 00:52:13.959
<v Chris>as a senior pastor for not quite 20 years.

00:52:14.119 --> 00:52:18.339
<v Chris>I don't know, 17, no, 18, 19, something like that. A long time.

00:52:18.719 --> 00:52:25.179
<v Chris>And 2024 and 2025 has been by far the most people a church our size has baptized.

00:52:25.179 --> 00:52:29.699
<v Chris>For us, a great Sunday would be like 125 people. So we're not a huge church.

00:52:29.939 --> 00:52:31.399
<v Chris>To baptize that many people is

00:52:31.399 --> 00:52:36.659
<v Chris>very much an outlier. And if you were to invite me to your small church.

00:52:37.059 --> 00:52:42.059
<v Chris>Medium church baptism conference this week and I was to speak and talk about

00:52:42.059 --> 00:52:45.359
<v Chris>how it happened, I don't know what I would say.

00:52:45.579 --> 00:52:50.959
<v Chris>I don't know that I would be like, okay, here's five steps that your church

00:52:50.959 --> 00:52:57.979
<v Chris>can take if you want to massively increase your baptisms. And I know 16 is not off the charts.

00:52:58.159 --> 00:53:03.619
<v Chris>You know, there's some churches out there, mega churches, they have this strategy for baptism.

00:53:03.679 --> 00:53:06.479
<v Chris>They baptize tons of people.

00:53:06.699 --> 00:53:10.819
<v Chris>Most of those people, I don't think, stick to their churches because they'll

00:53:10.819 --> 00:53:17.419
<v Chris>have these, quote, spontaneous baptisms a few times a year where thousands of people get baptized.

00:53:17.639 --> 00:53:20.779
<v Chris>And, you know, are they being discipled? I don't know.

00:53:20.779 --> 00:53:26.079
<v Chris>There was a church a few years ago that kind of had this strategy where they

00:53:26.079 --> 00:53:30.879
<v Chris>would have what they called spontaneous baptisms, and they would call on people

00:53:30.879 --> 00:53:32.039
<v Chris>to come up and get baptized.

00:53:32.039 --> 00:53:36.799
<v Chris>But the church actually had leaders and volunteers planted in the congregation

00:53:36.799 --> 00:53:40.899
<v Chris>that sort of pretended like they were coming down to get baptized.

00:53:41.159 --> 00:53:46.279
<v Chris>And so it sort of prime in the pump took advantage of the herd mentality.

00:53:46.599 --> 00:53:48.079
<v Chris>The fact of the matter is.

00:53:48.837 --> 00:53:54.137
<v Chris>God doesn't need our help in that way. And I'm not saying, hey, be frozen chosen.

00:53:54.437 --> 00:54:03.117
<v Chris>I'm saying the work of salvation is a work that begins and ends with God and His Holy Spirit.

00:54:03.397 --> 00:54:08.457
<v Chris>And the way those people got baptized over the last two years in our little

00:54:08.457 --> 00:54:14.677
<v Chris>fellowship was a work of God that did not have a human strategic component to it.

00:54:14.677 --> 00:54:20.517
<v Chris>We want to be a people who loves Jesus, follows his word, teaches his word,

00:54:20.717 --> 00:54:23.577
<v Chris>sings his word, loves each other. And that's important.

00:54:23.697 --> 00:54:28.317
<v Chris>If I could say, here's one practical thing that may have helped.

00:54:28.317 --> 00:54:30.277
<v Chris>And I don't even know if it did.

00:54:30.357 --> 00:54:35.077
<v Chris>We started talking about baptism a little bit more in 2024. And I don't mean

00:54:35.077 --> 00:54:37.617
<v Chris>like we're going to have 20 sermons on baptism.

00:54:37.837 --> 00:54:41.597
<v Chris>I mean, we started inviting people. If you believe the gospel,

00:54:41.837 --> 00:54:47.057
<v Chris>you should get baptized. As a pastor, I don't talk about offering a lot.

00:54:47.137 --> 00:54:52.017
<v Chris>I want to be on whatever the other side of manipulation is, and I don't want

00:54:52.017 --> 00:54:54.877
<v Chris>to manipulate people into being baptized a lot.

00:54:54.977 --> 00:54:59.557
<v Chris>But I realized at some point I probably wasn't opening the door enough.

00:54:59.737 --> 00:55:04.057
<v Chris>And if there's a key pastor, church leader out there, talk about it.

00:55:04.457 --> 00:55:09.237
<v Chris>Talk about the importance of it. Teach on what the Word of God says about it and invite people.

00:55:09.797 --> 00:55:16.897
<v Mike>Absolutely. And I think that's so key. sometimes we are a little bit stuck ourselves in

00:55:17.464 --> 00:55:21.224
<v Mike>Our deep desire to not manipulate people,

00:55:21.424 --> 00:55:27.804
<v Mike>to not sort of provoke false conversion or false assurance of salvation,

00:55:27.804 --> 00:55:32.584
<v Mike>we can end up on this other side where we're not inviting people into their

00:55:32.584 --> 00:55:34.644
<v Mike>first great act of obedience.

00:55:34.804 --> 00:55:37.764
<v Mike>We're sort of saying, hey, prove it to us first.

00:55:38.404 --> 00:55:43.784
<v Mike>And I personally don't find that anywhere in scripture. The Ethiopian eunuch

00:55:43.784 --> 00:55:46.144
<v Mike>doesn't have to prove anything to Philip.

00:55:46.324 --> 00:55:46.444
<v Chris>Yeah.

00:55:46.444 --> 00:55:53.804
<v Mike>And the Philippian jailer has an immediate conversion, and Paul baptizes him right then and there.

00:55:54.004 --> 00:56:01.084
<v Mike>And Peter calls for people as the first sign of obedience to come to a place

00:56:01.084 --> 00:56:05.904
<v Mike>of baptism when he gives his great sermon on the day of Pentecost, right?

00:56:06.064 --> 00:56:11.184
<v Mike>So I think it is incumbent on us as pastors and leaders to say,

00:56:11.424 --> 00:56:16.304
<v Mike>hey, we want you to follow Jesus in baptism. Now, we want to make sure that

00:56:16.304 --> 00:56:17.904
<v Mike>people are authentically converted.

00:56:17.964 --> 00:56:22.564
<v Mike>We want to make sure they have a deep and real understanding of the gospel that's

00:56:22.564 --> 00:56:25.164
<v Mike>appropriate to their age and their mentality.

00:56:26.061 --> 00:56:29.861
<v Mike>And we don't want to give them that false assurance of salvation,

00:56:29.861 --> 00:56:34.541
<v Mike>but we do want to encourage them to say, let's walk in obedience to Jesus.

00:56:34.821 --> 00:56:38.881
<v Mike>And, you know, a few years ago, I heard a missionary talking about this issue,

00:56:38.881 --> 00:56:46.201
<v Mike>and he said, listen, why are we asking people to live their lives as call them to be Christians,

00:56:46.401 --> 00:56:54.441
<v Mike>call them to follow Jesus, but not giving them the very command of Jesus to be baptized

00:56:55.021 --> 00:56:57.521
<v Mike>and to profess their faith in that way.

00:56:57.601 --> 00:57:03.441
<v Mike>And he said, I think we're withholding the blessing of God on their lives when

00:57:03.441 --> 00:57:08.001
<v Mike>we don't actively encourage people to say, hey, look, your first act of obedience,

00:57:08.361 --> 00:57:13.081
<v Mike>baptism doesn't save you, but if you are genuinely professing faith,

00:57:13.221 --> 00:57:18.161
<v Mike>you've repented of your sins, you're entrusting yourself to Jesus for salvation,

00:57:18.421 --> 00:57:23.241
<v Mike>your first act of obedience ought to be following Jesus in the waters of baptism.

00:57:23.501 --> 00:57:27.321
<v Chris>Yeah, amen. We got to do that. We got to talk about that. We got to say it.

00:57:27.501 --> 00:57:32.401
<v Chris>In the meantime, check out our website, everychurchflourishing.com and stay

00:57:32.401 --> 00:57:37.221
<v Chris>tuned for next Monday because we should have another brand new episode of Every

00:57:37.221 --> 00:57:41.621
<v Chris>Church Flourishing waiting for you then. Until then, Godspeed.